SEO Guarantees Should Not Exist
For many years I have been hearing lots of SEO companies that offer guarantees on search engine placement. I have argued this approach until I have been blue in the face and I think it is important to revisit this issue. Too many customers look for this guarantee and many are usually quite disappointed with the outcome when things fail to come through as promised.
Google recently held a clinic with certain members of the Google search quality team to go over and discuss hot button issues that seem to be on the minds of many website owners and webmasters. When Google comes out and says something about how an effort operates in their search engine people should listen. The clinic was held in Dublin and Google had sent invitations to many webmasters to come in and participate. I am personally pleased to see some of the topics that where covered as they are important to shed some light on.
Here is probably the most important question asked in my opinion:
“Should I believe SEO agencies that promise to make my site rank first in Google in a few months and with a precise number of links?”
Official Google Answer: No one can make that promise; therefore the short answer is no, you should not.”
People need to understand that no search engine marketing company on the planet should be promising or guaranteeing number #1 rankings in the search engines. (Rankings in general as a measurement for SEO is an old flawed metric, but that is another topic). Anybody that promises this is flat out lying and you should run for the hills. If they do get you rankings like that fairly quickly chances are they are using very strong black hat techniques which is not the answer to grow a business. There are many SEO businesses out there that prey on young websites and website owners that might not truly understand how search engine optimization really works. They think that rankings are the answer to success and they see false claims like these mentioned above and they assume they will be successful. To be successful online you need to grow a brand online. Give the people something to follow and be interested in. A website just sitting in search results is beneficial but certainly not the end all be all when it comes to the world of commerce. How many successful businesses do you know that simply thrive from a single search ranking?
Here is exactly what I say to people who ask for an SEO guarantee:
“Would you ask your attorney for a guarantee to win a case?”
“Would you ask your accountant for a guarantee for a tax return?”
“Would you ask your doctor for a guarantee on a surgery?”
“Would you as your plumber for a non-leak guarantee?”
I can keep going here…the answer is “NO”
So why should an SEO professional give a guarantee?
They should NOT! Please share your thoughts on this topic.
69 Responses to “SEO Guarantees Should Not Exist”
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Nick,
I completely agree. It is ashame that not enough people are educated on SEO, despite on the webinars and information out there.
Steve
Hi Nick!
I agree; you can do a lot of things to improve your client’s website, but you can’t really guarantee that the website will be top ranked in search engines in just a few months.
And like you shared, even Google said it just doesn’t work that way.
I think SEO outfits would be better off being more open with their clients and building a better understanding of their website improvement efforts than attempting to build instant trust with a guarantee.
Thank you.
Take care.
Hi Steve,
Exactly, education on SEO before you hire a firm or professional is essential…as a business owner, I always research and have basic knowledge before I invest in something for my business. Thanks for sharing your thoughts!
Hi Ken,
Thanks for reading and your comment. Exactly, SEO folks would be better off being much more open and honest in the beginning instead of taking on a client on an SEO guarantee just to hit their sales numbers…this is certainly not a good approach…
Hi Nick –
I totally agree with you and am glad that you continually talk about this topic. I’ve run into so many people who are skeptical because either they don’t know enough about SEO to know what is true and what is not, or they’ve been taken by an SEO company that didn’t deliver, because they couldn’t, on the guarantees that they promised.
As an SEO, I always walk my clients and our seo training attendees, through everything I do and explain why I do it. I want to make sure that through the process, they become educated consumers – because they are many of us out there who do know how to do SEO and we do it according to best practices.
Thanks for continuing to spread the word…
Hi Shelly,
Thanks for reading and your thoughts and comment…I do think that the SEO guarantee is a topic that should be talked about so we can slowly get rid of this ineffective practice and philosophy (with some clients out there). I agree that training is a good way to help educate clients about SEO…
Thanks again!
I totally agree Nick… the sad result of companies promising guaranteed placement is that it causes SEO pricing to increase…time spent educating clients on the process is time spent on each project. That’s why it’s important for Google to answer these types of questions and also important for SEO professionals to share the answers. It certainly speeds the customer learning process to be able to show “Google’s answer”. Thanks for the great post.
Hi Anita,
Thanks for reading and your comment. Yeah, it is really important to show the “Google answer” about SEO guarantees. This is a topic that I will continue to discuss and mention in this blog, because I think that it is that important. Whats nice is I can use this post as my answer to the guarantee question
Hi Nick,
I totally agree – same issue exists here in Canada. And… we also see those that claim to partner with Google to provide SEO services.
Helen Faber
Ottawa, Canada
Hi Helen,
Thanks for stopping by and sharing your thoughts…yeah the “partner with Google” is always a tough thing to see as well…thanks again!
[...] any sort of search engine rankings. In fact a few weeks ago I wrote another article about how SEO guarantees should not exist and there was some interesting [...]
Hi Nick and thanks for the post re: SEO guarantees.
I work with dozens of online merchants with their SEO/PPC efforts across the country and almost every other month one of my clients tell me that they have just signed an “guaranteed” placement for “up to 10 terms.” I try and dissuade them from doing it, but often they figure it’s worth a try. Not so!
Usually the companies supplying these so-called services require $150 approx up front and then you need to give them 15 day minimum to cancel. By the time the customers realize they have been snookered, they are usually at least $300 lighter in the wallet.
Keep up the good info.
Todd Greenwood
Nick ~ As usual…a great post. I find many of my current and some past SEO clients were told they had a guarantee for top placement on the SEs. Impossible is my retort, as we DO NOT CONTROL the algorithms. More importantly, guarantees create a huge sense of hope which is false. The real issue should be about client expectation management and being truthful. We do what we can to make the visitor experience better and hopefully that will translate to the SEs. Thoughts?
i totally agree, but i am an seo for a bathroom remodeling company and we have a no leak garuntee on our work… lol, but the rest hold very true! great article
Well said! Drives me nuts seeing all those flashy banners promising #1 this or that. Google, being the leading search engine, should be listened to: Quality, Uniqueness, Relevance, backlinks, etc. Its a model to build a strong website with roots.
Well done. We’ve read this time and time again by gurus and commentators alike. Sadly many employers still think there’s a holy grail when there is none.
I recently got asked this direct question in an invite for a screening for interview. I’ve yet to hear back from the company!!! I’ll let you know if I got invited!
I really, really liked your examples. They hit the nail on the head… It’s great that you gave some hard and easy to understand examples.
You stated, “Would you ask your doctor for a guarantee on a surgery?”. I think it needs to be stated with a higher ante. For example, “Doctor, can you cure my early stage cancer?”.
Sometimes one is lucky and touches the holy grail. It is cured. Google number 1… huzzah!
However, the same careful ritual performed for patient number 2. It’s a failure. Doctors,like SEO specialists have a duty of care and professionalism. They have their clients at heart and strive to match this. Black-hat is to quacks as SEO is to accredited medicine. Let’s try and remember this!
I own a large website and spend a ton on PPC. I have have taken classes on SEO, and read books and followed the blogs, so I know enough to be dangerous ( am I am still searching for a an SEO partner), and I desperately need the service. But I can not get by this industry’s lack of accountability. You hire a plumber to stop a leak, and you don’t pay until it is stopped, a lawyer to go to court, not win in court, an account to file taxes, not cheat the IRS. You hire an SEO to get rankings, not build a brand!
Google has a huge conflict of interest with the SEO world. Of course they would not want people to get a free clicks, it would kill their revenue stream, what do you expect them say? “Sure you can get a free click, you are welcome to by-pass our primary revenue driver, here is how you do it!”
Your job is figure out what Google cares about and if your client has the “right stuff”, product wise, do what it takes to get them ranked to their rightful position in the organic returns. It’s a “zero sum game”, and either you know enough to get him above the competition or you don’t, if he’s willing to spend the money, like me. It’s pretty simple.
So when I call up and say, I need to be above the fold for this particular keyword, or being ranked organically will not help me very much, and you say, “Well that will take about 1 year and 100K, but I can’t guarantee you will make it above the fold, but I get paid regardless, whether I get you there or not, I’m sorry, there is no guarantee, even though you are hiring me specifically to get you ranked above the fold.”
I just find this attitude to be extremely self serving, and lacks accountability to your client. And it is this lack of accountability that has given your industry such a shady reputation. Exactly the opposite of your “run for the hills” premise.
Stand up. Be accountable. Say to your clients, “I believe in my ability, and if I don’t get you there you don’t have to pay me”. Just like the plumber I hired last week, when he stopped the leak, I paid him, no questions asked, and I’d hire him again! The SEO that can embrace this concept will change the industry for the better, and bring it out of the dark and into the light.
Thanks listening to my rant,
Lee
The only two things in life that are truthfully guaranteed are taxes and death! All the other guarantees are just a whole lot of baloney.
I completely agree with this post. And the “guarantees” those SEO companies are offering typically aren’t worth the paper they are written on.
Why? Because the SEO company guarantees it will get you top rankings, but what they don’t fully explain is the keywords you will be ranked highly for will be really obscure long-tail keywords that nobody else competes for…or searches for.
As a result, it’s extremely easy to rank highly for these keywords because there is no competition for them. But the SEO company can claim they got you top rankings when you site ranks highly for them.
In reality, ranking highly in SERPs for valuable keywords takes three things: effort, patience, and a little bit of luck. Keep building DO FOLLOW backlinks to your website using your keywords in the anchor text, and back that up with relevant content on the pages on your website that you are linking to, and you’ll move up in SERPs. It’s not a sprint…it’s definitely a marathon. But every journey starts with one step, so start stepping.
Good luck!
I completely agree with you Nick. As a web developer SEO is somewhat new to me. Recently I had a client wanting to rank on the top within 3 months of the launch. What I feel is new websites should focus on offline marketing and tailing keywords as well, but because of these SEO companies making false claims everybody wants to be on top.
Thanks everyone for your comments!
Hi Darron,
Great, point following a white hat approach to SEO does prompt for a good foundation!
Hi Alton J.,
I think accountability is very important but so is setting proper client expectations from the very beginning…
Hi Lee,
Based on where you are at, I would recommend that you purchase some sort of advanced custom SEO training to learn how to build your positioning and organic visitor growth on your own. It may take you more time, but I think you will find it more rewarding (especially if you only want a guarantee or performance based SEO program).
I appreciate your comments, thoughts (and rant!
As the owner of an SEO/SEM firm, I don’t feel it is a good practice to spend hundreds of hours (on site SEO and off site SEO/link building) and only get paid if the results are there. Would you go to an offline marketing company and ask them to write, design, print, pay for postage, etc. for a direct mail campaign and only pay them if the lead generation program brings you results…NO!
I respect your opinion, but I certainly do not agree with it, anyway, thanks for reading!
Everyone makes great points. There are charlatans in every business who over promise and under deliver. However, it is not uncommon to get guarantees in any number of commercial transactions. Indeed it is not totally uncommon to get a money back “Satisfaction” guarantee (if you don’t like it return it for a refund). So the notion that guarantees, in general, are unreasonable is itself unreasonable. And, yes, even lawyers make performance guarantees. They often take cases on “contingency” – If they don’t win they don’t get paid. And my accountant is on the hook to prepare my taxes properly and if he doesn’t he does it again until he gets it right and pays any penalties I may be assessed. Performance guarantees are a longstanding business convention.
Why is a performance guarantee so unreasonable in the SEO business? I completely understand that no one likes to work for nothing. But the SEO companies must also understand that no one likes paying for nothing. Site owners don’t want hard work and good intentions they want results. It strikes me that a professional, experienced SEO ought to be able to evaluate a site and make a conservative estimate of what he can accomplish for the site, in what time frame, and using only White Hat techniques.
No sensible business person wants a guarantee that is likely to need enforcing. Rational buyers look for reasonable claims that vendors have a very high probability of delivering on. After all, the buyer is looking for the solution to his problem and not a waste of time at the end of which he is left in the same position as he started.
It seems to me that professional SEOs ought to be able to make reasonable claims and deliver on them. Knowing what you can accomplish and actually achieving it 90% of the time could be a great differentiator. If your sensible performance estimates cause you to lose a prospect or customer to the beguiling and inflated claims of a charlatan, then you haven’t lost anything you are not better off without.
I totally agree with you.
LOTS of peoples are asking for SEO Guarantee and I have the same reply -
“Would you ask your lawyer for a guarantee to win a case?”
“Would you ask your doctor for a guarantee on a surgery?”
I take guarantee for using ethical SEO techniques.
Nice article. I have said this time and time again. If someone promises page one or any ranking run, run really fast… It amazes me to see even mid-sized SEO companies making the promise of page one. I had a prospect ask me yesterday if they can run a low dollar SEO campaign and get top 5 rankings for 5 keywords. My response was that I never promise any rankings, but you will be better off then if you do nothing…
My sales team is pushing me to come up with a guarantee they can relay to our clients, and I am pushing back.
They refer to SEO moz
http://www.seomoz.org/pro_landing.php
Who on their landing page DO have several guarantees
“Boost your website’s rankings within 30 days–Guaranteed”
If the MOZ – which is NOT a fly by night company has a guarantee, then how can we not have one is their argument. They also have clients like “Lee”, who are of the opinion that it’s a “put up or shut-up” proposition…
I myself have been an opponent of guarantees in the past..
I am one of the few that have to respectfully disagree. As a marketing company, sure, you cannot guarantee any particular return on investment, but you dang sure better try to deliver. And if you guaranteed results that were never achieved, you owe your customer at least a partial refund and an apology for not being able to do what you thought you could, but at least you tried. If all marketers just went around telling businesses, “If you give me X amount of dollars, I really have no clue what I’m going to do for you.” There has to be some sort of standard in the industry. Results have to be measurable, and if you guarantee something, you should do your diligence and deliver a plan of action to achieve your guarantee. If your customer agrees to your plan of action, and doesn’t get quite what they were hoping for, at least they have a list of services that were performed and don’t feel like they threw their money away and received nothing for it. There should probably be a contingency agreement based on what results were achieved. If you achieved nothing, then you need to get out of internet marketing, there’s enough of us already. It’s all these marketers that cold call or walk to businesses, sell them a service, and achieve no results. The customers opinion of internet marketing has been destroyed, and when a good internet marketer comes along that can seriously help their business, they may be too suspicious to do the deal. But if all marketers said maybe we’ll get results, maybe we won’t, then the entire field of internet marketing would be destroyed.
AND YES – when I hire a plumber, I expect there to be no leaks when he leaves.
If I hire a lawyer, he better be damn sure he can win (that’s why many work on contingency – that IS a guaranty of success, or you pay nothing.)
If I get a surgery, and my doctor screws up, he needs to know he’s getting sued.
I like my contractors to be productive and successful. If you can’t at least guarantee that, find a new job.
Mark Rogers
Custom Business Marketing & Sales Consulting, Inc
Thanks for the additional comments everyone!
Hi Tilak,
I think what you said about offering guarantee for using ethical SEO techniques, makes sense and many times this is the approach that I personally take. I often do tell potential clients that I do guarantee that the work outlined in advance will get completed, on time and they will be better off then they were before they optimized their site, etc.
In my opinion, the bottom line is, offering a ranking or sales increase guarantee for SEO should not happen as it does prompt a black hat approach and often is a sleezy sales technique to rope in a client. For those of you that disagree with me, I appreciate your comments, thoughts and your opinion and we will agree that we disagree
I would like to see if any clients out there (brave ones) can chime in here and talk about their experiences working with an SEO firm that had offered a guarantee (not on their work but on rankings and sales increase) and how it worked for them? I have heard a tremendous amount of horror stories over the years but it would be great if we got that viewpoint in our discussion here…
What do you think about performance based pay (like Rankpay)?
Hi Matthias,
Great question, (might even be a topic for a blog post). I personally have not met ANY client, company, etc that has had LONG TERM success with a performance based arrangement. The only time I can think that it might work is if total control of every aspect of the on site SEO, off site SEO (link building) and for a well established business that has been online for many years and already has a great search engine trust factor. Otherwise, it may not work for a newer company/website. I have not had any personal experience with a company like Rankpay, but I would be interested to hear from any company that has had great LONG term results with them?
Thanks for reading and putting this great question out there!
Wow, quite a hot topic over here. This is my personal experience. I’ve one website which is not index by Google but got indexed by Yahoo and Bing. I tried seeking services to get my site index on Google which provide guarantee indexing within 1 week, one from SEO firm and another from an individual guy.
After the expiration of 1 week, my site was still not index. The individual guy(respectable one) contacted me asked for my paypal account to refund me the money. However, the SEO company, only refunded my money after numerous complaints and requests.
Hi tricajus,
Thanks for your comment and for sharing your story!
I totally agree with you Nick. None of the SEO agencies own the search engines, so how can anyone guarantee top ranking? However, efforts can be put to get the best search engine results and believe me, this works.
I totally agree on guarantees Nick. We have had guarantees down as one of our myths on search engine optimisation in an article on our website for many years.
We still get asked by many prospects for a guarantee and always politely decline on ethical grounds. However it tends to mean we shall lose the business as a naive client will often go for a guarantee over none – OK they may learn but at that stage the business is gone from us…. Occasionally our arguments are taken on board and we get the client.
My main arguments include:
- this is a competitive environment – we can control the quality and quantity of what we do but not what the client does (eg on link building) nor their competitors
- timescales – especially with new sites to achieve results
- most competitor guarantees are worthless – don’t tackle meaningful terms nor give a value if called upon
- are you really going to sue someone in India?
I don’t agree however than plumbers are in a competitive situation against a plumbing system unless it’s in a Disney movie – perhaps a no leak guarantee makes sense for them!
It’s good we can quote Google now too!
Hi Dave,
Thanks for sharing your thoughts about SEO guarantees, your arguments make total sense, especially suing an SEO overseas!
In this regard, SEO is a lot like public relations, another field in which I used to work.
Back in the early 1990s, companies wanted a guarantee that they’d be featured on the cover of Wired or Red Herring. There were a lot of factors that went into a “great pitch”: interview with very high-level executive, revenue projections or other numbers, happy clients willing to be interviewed. But even if our client had every one of those things and more, there still was no way to tell them they’d be featured in a specific position in a specific publication.
Because, guess what? Things change. There are outside factors over which you have NO control. And in the end, it is the editor who makes the decision on what story gets ink, just as it is the search engine algorithm that makes the decision on ranking your pages.
Hi Michelle,
Great analogy to SEO vs PR…thanks for sharing your thoughts!
The issue is you have put yourself out there as an expert. An expert to achieve rankings on Google. Anyone hiring you is not an expert, or they would not need you, they don’t know what to do, all the client knows is that they need rankings. So when you say, “I’ll guarantee to use best practices”, it’s a meaningless guarantee, unless you achieve rankings! Any SEO worth their salt should be able to evaluate your site, and for the keywords you want, make an estimate of their likelihood of achieving those rankings, just like a lawyer taking a case on a contingency basis.
I have I have been burned twice by hiring SEO companies that did not deliver, they took my money, and said “sorry, we don’t give guarantees”. Now, maybe, I should have hired a more reputable companies, no doubt, because I don’t think my key words are that tough on a relative basis, but don’t give me that hogwash about you get what you pay for, or you choose the wrong company, or I did not do enough homework, or get enough references, people only give you the good references, and everyone says they use the latset techniques and best practices.
I’m looking for a performance based long term SEO partner (like the rest of my vendors that have been with me for years), that I’m willing to pay 50K to 100K a year for, but only when I get results. Burned once shame on you, burned twice, shame on me, burned three times, I should not be in business! And I’m not the Lone Ranger.
Hi Lee,
Thanks again for sharing your thoughts so openly. Many years ago (when I first got into the SEO world), I decided to not take ANY take any of this personal…it is business and as an SEO professional, I do respect all viewpoints.
Again, I do feel that learning and practicing SEO (thus becoming an expert over time) would be the best way to go in your case based on how you have described SEO.
If you ever meet a performance based SEO firm or agency that can meet your expectations and achieve your sales and visitor growth goals, I would love to hear your story and case study from them to share with all of our readers.
Anyway best of luck with your SEO efforts! Take Care!
You asked if there were any clients who have had long term success with a Guaranteed SEO company…I’m one! I have to say I disagree with your story. I’m sure there are many shady companies offering a guarantee (just as there are ones who do not.). My first SEO experiences (2 of them) were terrible and a huge waste of money. On my second try, I was debating between a company who seemed very reputable and did offer a guarantee and one who didn’t. I was talked out of using the guarantee company by the company who didn’t offer one, and they used many of the reasons you cited above. I really wished I hadn’t listened.
I decided to give it one more shot and called back the guarantee company. That was several years ago and I couldn’t be happier about the results. We have been ranking very well for our phrases for years in our chosen keyword and have added a second site which is ranking well with this company too.
I have to say it’s not a matter of guarantee or not. With a little research I could tell this company was not making unreasonable promises like some guarantee SEO companies. They didn’t try to use obscure keyword, promise results in 30 days or anything else that seemed too good to be true. While one can claim they know for certain they will get you to the first page, they can offer a financial incentive for themselves to do so. I appreciate that my company puts their money where their mouth is. Works for me!
Hi Krista,
Thanks very much for sharing your story! I am SHOCKED and very happy to hear your story. This is the first time in my 12 years in this industry that I have ever heard an ethical, white hat SEO firm that offers an guarantee and has achieved long term and long lasting results.
Too bad we could not see what your website is for more of an official type of case study (that is an idea for you to share with your SEO firm, it would look REALLY good for them).
As a business owner and consumer I agree with both sides of the fence. Web design as online marketing in general are completely unregulated in both price and practices. Because there is so much grey matter to nearly every aspect of these industries an inordinate amount of education is required. Yet still there is no guarantee clients get it. Clients purchasing a web site rarely, if ever, get a guarantee beyond the creation of the website. As internet marketers we know full well that we can dominate most searches, it depends on how much the client wants it and is willing to invest.
What good is a guarantee to reach #1 in Google if it cannot be sustained? Of if there is no search volume for the keyword(s) and thus no traffic to purchase? SEO is publicity. SEO is advertising. No publicity or advertising offers guarantees of performance or sales. How do you justify holding SEO to a different standard?
I agree with your advice to Lee as it will teach him first hand why SEO cannot be guaranteed.
Hi Gabrielle,
Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the SEO guarantee topic. Great point about comparing SEO to publicity or advertising and how it is crazy to hold SEO professionals to a different standard. Thanks again for your comment!
More important than whether or not a guarantee should be offered, is possibly educating would-be offer-accepters about how difficult it is for the SEO company offering them the guarantee to do what they say they are going to do for them. However logical your post, you’re not likely to change EVERY SEO company’s business plan. The best offense is a good defense. If we educate people on some SEO basics, they can make a must better choice, and skip the slick-worded offers that are designed to take money directly out of their pockets.
And, to your point on guarantees…why would I NOT want a guarantee from my doctor, lawyer, or accountant? If they tell me they are going to do something, give me a price, and put their money where their mouth is, why would I not take advantage of that offer. Think about commission-based sales people. Isn’t their daily work a “guarantee” that they will sell something for their employer (or affiliate) or they won’t get a paycheck? Guarantees are a VERY strong sales technique that helps alleviate customer concern about getting ripped off. Even if a company has to honor a few refunds because they didn’t get the job done well enough, they often still make more profits on the income side because of the guarantee they offer. Setting yourself above the competition is important, and I don’t see guarantees going away any time soon.
Swimming with the current is far easier than swimming against it, Nick. If customers want guarantees, offer them a BETTER guarantee than your competitor, and then stand behind it 100%, asking for referrals when you complete what you say you’re going to do in the time you say you’re going to do it in. If an SEO company is confident in their abilities to get a client ranked to a certain level (using white-hat only) in a certain amount of time, then giddy-up. I’ll take the bet, because if I lose, I have more traffic. If I win, I’m out nothing, aside from my time of finding one more way that doesn’t work (Albert Einstein).
Kevin
Hi Kevin,
Thanks for sharing your thoughts and leaving your comment!
You make some good point, but I still don’t think having a guarantee for an SEO service provider is a good idea. I still like the comment that was made on this post about comparing it to marketing or publicity. I have never (or very rarely – I can’t remember seeing it) seen a guarantee offered for a marketing or PR service. Which SEO is a direct marketing medium and can be compared to these…okay, I should have not compared SEO to a lawyer or plumber as that is not apples to apples either!
I disagree with your position. We do guarantee or work. However, let me clarify – my company does not promise links or #1 spots nor do we take on competing clients (how can you have two #1 clients in the same profession and area?) We work with each client individually and come up with reasonable bench marks that must be met. If they are not met, they do not pay.
We also can offer payment tied to performance guarantees because we do not take every client who asks for our services – only those we know we can help and no two competing clients.
Attorneys may not offer a guarantee but they take cases on a contingency basis because they believe that the chances are very good that they will win – enough so that they are willing to bear all financial risks up front. That is how an SEO business should operate. Do not take clients you do not think you can help and set reasonable expectations. Calculate your own risks and bear the risks yourself.
Instead of asking if you would ask an attorney (who DOES risk all for their clients) if they would guarantee their work, you should be asking “Why should your clients have to bear all the financial risks upfront?” Mine don’t and neither do attorney’s clients.
Hi Lahle,
Thanks for reading and sharing your thoughts and opinions about SEO and guarantees…
[...] article by Nick Stamoulis (Brick Marketing) in the Search Engine Optimization Journal. The article, “SEO Guarantees Should Not Exist,” had more than 40 comments, mostly from other SEO professionals supporting his [...]
I’m in the same camp with Ms Lahle Wolfe above; or perhaps she’s in my camp.
Our service also shoulders the burden of risks for SEO and we guarantee our clients will only pay for services AFTER they achieve well-defined 1st page positions in the search engines for their most competitive, productive keywords.
The client shouldn’t have to pay for incompetence, or for something (SEO) about which they have zero knowledge to properly gauge its performance or application.
Oh yeah sure I agree; no one can, or should explicitly guarantee that Google or any search engine will respond favorably to what the SEO does, however, unless they (a search engine) does, the client shouldn’t be compelled to fork over cash for an exercise that failed.
Granted, the SEO who warrants #1 positions is a fool and likely a sham; still there is nothing unscrupulous about promoting 1st page positions. Fact is, if you can’t get your client to page one where the fish are biting, you’re not an SEO.
John Barremore
Houston, TX
Hi John,
Thanks for sharing your thoughts and your comment!
You make some good points in sharing your opinion, but I think your philosophy is flawed. Any good quality SEO service provider should be taking a quality and marketing approach to on site optimization and building relevant links over time. SEO is much more than an exercise, it is a complete workout that should keep your body (website) healthy
Thanks again,
Nick
Hi Nick,
You’re quite welcome — and thanks for the opportunity to share.
I think the “quality” of an SEO service is best determined by its success for helping its clients. If by a “marketing approach to on site optimization” you mean offering the client design suggestions for better conversions, well sure, I do that everyday.
However, in the purest definition, SEO means emphasizing page content to increase positioning potential in the SERPS and ultimately reaching certain keyword ranking goals. Establishing inbound links is a given for the overall task.
All that said, I do not see where my business model or philosophy is flawed. I perform a service and get paid; if I’m unable to deliver as promised, the client doesn’t pay. Pretty simple concept. It’s good for the client and good for myself. It serves to cultivate trust, proclaims my skills, protects the client’s interests and provides incentive to do my best.
How is this win/win philosophy flawed?
John Barremore
Houston, TX
Hi John,
Thanks for the clarification, from what you have stated here, you philosophy sounds very clear to me
Thanks again for sharing your thoughts and time!
I guess I am in your camp, John. I agree SEO is not just an exercise in meta data.
If you are not going to tie performance into pay, at the very least an SEO company should provide complete transparency about what they are doing each day/week on the site in detail. This would allow clients to verify work was being done and to decide if they should continue paying for a particular service.
We get more clients than is acceptable coming from companies that charge a monthly retainer fee without providing report of the work done (this is not the same is analytical reports.)
I do not feel the need to educate clients about how hard SEO is. They already know how hard it is and probably failed to rank their sites on their own or they would not be hiring an SEO company in the first place!
But we educate them why a particular type of work or service is necessary and how/why it will help. We tell them what we are doing and do not pretend to have trade secrets or special affiliations with Google (or anyone else.)
Some clients are just interested in learning about SEO so they can take over their own sites. So I am curious how you feel about SEO companies teaching their tricks of the trade to clients so that they (clients) are responsible for the outcome if a company will not offer a guarantee?
Thank you for allowing everyone to share such differing opinions. This has been a great and informative thread. It would be easy for you to hit “delete comment” with those whom you disagree with. I commend you for not doing so.
Hello Nick,
To me the key lies in the following statement you made:
“Rankings in general as a measurement for SEO is an old flawed metric.” This proves especially true in local service markets such as dentistry where top rankings for common phrases do nothing more than offer false assurances as there is little to no traffic in these standard phrases. If you offer a performance guarantee based on this you are misleading your customers in making them believe that they now have an optimized site. Good for you, not for the client. Your guarantee should be based on an increase in site visitors and page views while keeping the bounce rate low.
The Visible Dentist suggests an increase of 300 visitors per month per 200,000 city population after SEO work. So in a city like Los Angeles a dentist should see a guaranteed figure of 6,000 visitors per month after SEO. Now that’s worth a lot more than page 1 bragging rights.
Hi Lahle,
I appreciate you sharing your thoughts and viewpoint. I would never delete a real (non spam) comment as that is the point of having a blog…to communicate and share thoughts and viewpoints, not have a subject be all 1 way (my way/way of thinking)
Hi Wilhelm,
Good quality SEO results is not about bragging rights (although as nice is that is), it is about generating and building business, which 6,000 visitor growth certainly is…thanks for the comment!
Nick,
I see both sides on this. I agree with the Visible Dentist – at least with regards to the fact that the SEO SHOULD know what the hell they’re doing before they start doing the work.
If you’re a prospect, always ask for client references and proof of previous successes. If it sounds too good to be true (awesome results – very little cost),it is — netphrases [dot] com for example…..
If the prospect still wants to ‘chase’ rankings at that point – even after they’ve been ‘educated’ about relevant traffic and conversions, etc… then I say go ahead and offer the ‘performance based’ campaign – a small retainer each month to cover at least some costs, and a % based performance fee for each week/month that their selected keyword phrase appears in the X position.
A sliding scale can work to your advantage in these situations – for each week their selected keyword phrase(s) that appears on the 1st page – $ xx.00 additional
Appearing in position 4-6: $ xx.00
Appearing in position 1-3 $ xxx.00
If they go after 3 competitive terms, and you told them $300 mo/retainer + $100/week for each #1-3 spot, you’d be making $1500/mo on avg. (assuming you could get all 3 to those positions)
In many cases, this is much more than you’d be able to get out of the client with just a straight flat fee – but in these cases, a contract is a must (one that spells out the client’s responsibilities as well) – as is a card on file.
Of course, you also run into all kinds of discrepancies with this billing method, like: my cousin said the site ISN’T showing up in the #x position, or you said I’m #1 but I’m not on maps, etc…
I would never flat out guarantee a top #1-3 position these days. If it happens it happens.
Hi The overworked SEO,
Thanks for reading and sharing your thoughts…I see that you are with an internet marketing company, have you ever taken on any clients using this pricing model? If so, where you able to sustain their positioning using white hat techniques? And if so for how long? I would also love to hear from a client that purchased one of these types of performance based SEO services and had long lasting results (done well for longer than 12 months)…
Thanks again for the comment,
Nick
Agreed just with the title of this blog! It really annoys me when I meet someone who so arrogantly says they will get you to ‘the top of google’!
Don’t talk about doing it, don’t say you’ll do it, just do it!
My pet hate is that clients are not educated about how the net/ranking works, but to some extent they won’t listen anyway.
I agree you cannot say you will get a definate page ranking and anyway the SEO company should be explaining to the client that the work we do is based on one or more keywords. To me its going to be very difficult to guarantee to have 10 keywords all ranking on the first page of Google, quickly anyway.
Clients sometimes are there own worst enemy though, they themselves should be trying to at least understand what they are purchasing.
If the client is after any sort of service level they should take the time to get involved in the definition of the service, its not about ranking or placement its about traffic. But it has to be noted that if the site is on page 22 of Google for all of the keywords then the liklehood of being found from a search engine is remote.
The client is buying into a Marketing strategy and they should take the time to put the web design company under the spotlight and define correct terms. For me you could have a tiered system of costs but it should be based on increased traffic that can be proven to have arrived based on the strategy that is being used.
We build SEO into all of our sites, this allows us to work with a small number of keywords but ensure the important elements of that site are synchronised with these keywords. Before we start development we find keywords that we know are not too competative but that will drive traffic, we then optimise the site for these.
Thanks,
John.
Hi John,
Thanks for reading and sharing your thoughts!
You bring up some excellent points, but the one that sticks out in my mind the most from what you said is an SEO client is buying into a marketing strategy. I think too often clients think that every part of their web marketing works in a silo, when in actuality every part of an internet marketing plan fits into and feeds each other, especially a white hat approach to SEO…
Ok, let me come at this from the viewpoint of someone that DOES offer a guarantee.
My guarantee is simple.
I will get the majority of your search terms on page 1 of Google or I will give you your money back.
I can offer this with confidence as I have over 15 years experience and my last few SEO campaigns never went below 75% page one listings.
My last client saw 100%
If you understand the process it is not difficult.
It is also not due to linking.
Most of the necessary work is on page and no “trickery” is involved. Metas like <meta name="SEO" content=" and <meta name="zipcode" content=" are not necessary.
I would have to be really dumb a**ed to not figure out what Google wants after 12 years of catering to them eh?
I am not talking about "weak" keyword phrases but those targeting the company's core products and services. The money makers.
SEO is ALL about results.
IT is all about getting your client in the top positions for their keyword phrases.
I used to offer SEO by results.
PRICING BASED ON PERFORMANCE
$75.00 for each # 1 listing
$50.00 for each position from # 2 to # 10
$35.00 for each position from # 11 to # 20
Not by week or month, but a one time payment.
Here is an screen from my old site.
http://dotcom-productions.com/images/guaranteed-page-1-seo-old.gif
Most of my small clients could not afford fees like this. Even the smallest would be looking at over $2000 for a realistic campaign.
With all the changes in Google's algos, the complete restructuring of PR, and their high standards for relevance, success depends on picking your keyword phrases carefully then developing their relevance in the site.
With the amount of competition in most areas online, success depends on defining your niche.
While Google's keywords tool may report no searches for a phrase, it is not all that accurate.
I have seen where Google reports no traffic but the client receives 10 or more searches for that exact phrase per month, which could be worth over $5,000 annually.
SEO is results oriented. What do you tell a client if you cannot get their primary KW phrase in the top 100?
I have to agree that clients are their own worst enemies.
I had to turn one away because he would not consider a content change. HIS boss told him "I want some of thet there SEO stuff in the site. I want you to move all our competition down and take their place.", but would not consider a departure from a totally graphic layout.
best,
Reg
nbs-seo.com
Hi Reg,
Thanks so much for reading and presenting your thoughts! It does make sense and is good to hear the other side of things!
Take Care,
Nick
Great thread. Several points I would like to discuss. I totally agree that guarantees should not be given, but in Reg’s case he’s been doing this long enough and knows what will work and what won’t.
Secondly, truer words were never spoken about how clients sabotage themselves and your work. I have seen this happen several times and had to clean up the mess.
Thirdly, I disagree with teaching clients how to do this. After things have been screwed up royally they come back wanting you to fix it. However, I do agree with making sure they understand everything and what the process is all about. They must also understand that we may get them on the first page for their chosen keywords and primary markets, but we can’t make people click.
I also have to disagree that guaranteeing first page placement means using black hat. I get them on the first page and I don’t know how to do black hat. Never learned it. I get more satisfaction getting top rankings without smoke and mirrors. Underhanded tactics always get found out. Just ask that “locksmith” who was spamming the maps listings with a bazillion sites and fake addresses, who called me by the way. Wanted a bunch of maps listings done for locksmith and admitted that all the locations were fake. I turned him down. I had already read about him in the Google threads.
Question: Whats the going rate when a client asks for extra keywords? We give them three and get them first page for those. I then search using any combination of those and can find them on the first page as well. This is great, but when they specifically ask “Can I add another keyword?” What is the usual rate and what do you base it on?
Thanks. Really like this topic and have been waiting for it to come up.
I think the post is a bit misguided.
Sure, strictly speaking, no SEO guarantee should be made.
On the other hand, I think it’s perfectly fine and desirable to give a conditional SEO guarantee – “I guarantee these results with respect to these metrics by this date, OR your money back”.
It is actually common and accepted for malparactice lawyers to give such conditional guarantees – “I win your case or there is no charge” or “I only get paid 10% of damages you win”. Plumbers, car mechanics, they often do give such conditional guarantees – a refund is the task they are charged with is not actually addressed.
I think that an SEO provider who fails to give such a *conditional* guarantee, on the pretext that no guarantees whatsoever should be made, is far more likely to skimp on his work and exploit clients, than an SEO provider who does make such a conditional guarantee. Ergo, clients should be very wary of SEO providers who use such an excuse.
Thanks Syed for reading and sharing your thoughts (100% correct) about SEO guarantees…
Take Care,
Nick
@ Reg Charie – NBS SEO
Not sure why you provide a guarantee even though you claim that you’ve been doing SEO for 15 years. The fact of the matter is, there is no real “SEO expert” out there. You can find individuals and companies who may have tons of experience and know how to handle certain situations – however with the changing nature of the internet and search engines themselves, the expertise deteriorates and unless one keeps up to date with the trends, they will definitely fall behind.
Furthermore, it is a common now a days for clients to back off from companies who have a guarantee disclaimer, this is because many of them are educated enough to realize that it will most likely be a scam service. A review of the various internet marketing and SEO services that you should incorporate are briefed here and can be read through: http://www.9thsphere.com/services_marketing.html (reputation management for example, is something many companies overlook). Now a days it is critical to also incorporate many other things into your strategy besides just “On-page SEO”.
I couldnt agree more. I believe offering ranking guarantees is misleading to the client and just downright unethical.
I cant understand how SEO firms that practice this are still getting away with it as a sales pitch.
In response to Newton Dentists: I don’t think SEO’s should offer a “conditional guarantee” or any other kind. A conditional guarantee would be “I’ll do my part, you follow these rules and then we’ll both win”. Each of the two parties has a stake in the outcome.
As SEO’s we cannot guarantee what a third party (Google) will do… hence that would be like the dentist guarantees your new teeth will help you win a beauty contest. The dentist would be offering a guarantee for what the judge will do…
This is so true bearing in mind the number of scams that are ever present. The issue at present in the industry is so many companies make promises that they cannot deliver on.
@Syed
Instead of looking at SEO as a series of “situations”, you need to look at it more holistically.
If you understand HOW Google approaches their indexing system, what they look for, how they judge the content, then there are no surprises as the Google updates are only tweaks to improve performance. You need to look at the same factors applied to a human visitor.
How, Where, What, they read are the controlling factors.
As for Guarantees, I offer them on all my products.
I sell software and state:
Don’t like our filters?
Tell us and get your money back.
The closest I have come to actually doing this was a 20 minute Skype call to assist the customer in installing the software.
I have the same 100% success rate with my SEO.
If you are looking at SEO, pretty much all you need is onpage.. Links do not count anymore and Social is more Search Marketing than SEO.
Social will build your local profile and offers many traffic building linking opportunities.
Retweets, likes, G+1 votes have a temporary effect on SERPs. Multiple G+1 citations have an effect, but this is based on content.
I offer everything you do except email marketing, which I wish could be “fixed”.
@Nick
“Rankings in general as a measurement for SEO is an old flawed metric”
Really?
What is the primary objective in SEO?
Why do you SEO a page?
A= To get the best listing possible.
“If they do get you rankings like that fairly quickly chances are they are using very strong black hat techniques which is not the answer to grow a business.”
NONSENSE!
Don’t you remember Caffeine? The update Google did to speed up the index?
I just documented an overnight change effected by a simple heading rewrite. (From #8 to #2).
Top results generate traffic.
It is not just ONE search ranking but a combination of dozens or even hundreds, given the length of tail.
Here is exactly what I say to people who ask for an SEO guarantee:
“Would you ask your attorney for a guarantee to win a case?” — YES! Contingency
“Would you ask your accountant for a guarantee for a tax return?”
YES! And he does.
“Would you ask your doctor for a guarantee on a surgery?”
NO but I would look at his odds.
“Would you as your plumber for a non-leak guarantee?”
YES I would also make certain his work is guaranteed up to code.
“So why should an SEO professional give a guarantee?”
As a matter of reassurance.
My Personal SEO Guarantee.
If you follow my outline exactly and do not get the majority of your pages on page one of Google results (the top 10), not only will I refund your money but I will give you a free year of professional grade hosting valued at $219.45 .
@Hamilton Switches
The amount of scams are endless.
Given that Google finally announced their policy on linking, the sites that still offer SEO linking programs are also scamming.
There is NO white hat SEO linking.
ALL linking to try to affect their SERPs is totally black hat.
best,
Reg
Hi Reg,
Thanks for reading and commenting on a post I wrote from 2010.
What I said back then, still stands. The bottom line is the main purpose of an SEO program is to increase targeted website visitors from the search engines…not rankings.
Anyway, everyone is entitled to their opinion and I respect yours and thank you for sharing your thoughts here.
Take Care,
Nick